Before the US made it clear that they are Israel's ally, there were several major wars between Israel and the peace-loving Arabs as the Arabs tried to destroy the country.

Maybe liberals want to go back to the days of major wars?

You're taking a complex issue and trying to make it black and white in a few short sentences. I applaud you for the attempt, but uhm... no.

Most issues are not as complex as people make them out to be.

Nuclear power cannot be bad if the west employs it and good if Iran does, no matter how complex the story.

Or are you trying to take a simple issue and make it complex?

I'm no expert on nuclear power, though honestly the thought of a plant anywhere near my place doesn't exactly send happy chills down my spine. I'm not saying I'm afraid or what not, just concerned about something that powerful and that...vast, so to speak.

Personally, I favor other alternative energies - like hydrogen, wind, etc. What Iran does, is their own matter - not ours.

The world is, together.

No, I would likely mention it to the police so they could then do what is necessary.

I get that, but does that give us the right to tell them what to do? It comes across as pretentious.

I'm talking about from us. Time and again - being the buddies that we seem to be with them - we've never given Israel an ultimatum (I'm not sure what to make of Clinton's comments...) to quit bulldozing camps and all. Why?

And of course, anyone that is blunt and speaks their mind about Israel is suddenly guilty of anti-semitism. Fyi, one of my best friends is Jewish, and I've an adopted grandfather whom I love dearly that is a Rabbi. So, yeah...no.

Because it is ridiculously innappropriate, not to mention anti-Semitic, to tell Israel not to use bulldozers to destroy weapons factories and terrorist hideouts.

Why exactly should the US give Israel an ultimatum about this? I don't get it.

You are alreading telling Israel that apparently the Arab part of "Palestine" must be Jew-free (without, of course, giving the Arabs a similar ultimatum about Arab settlements in Israel, which are also expanding illegally).

(Incidentally, the reason Jewish "settlements" in "Palestine" are expanding "illegally" is that there is a death penalty on selling land to Jews in "Palestine". Hence when Jews buy land, it is "illegal". And the UN and now the US are promoting this law. Liberals are usually against the death penalty. But it apparently depends on the crime.)

What exactly is your problem here? Are you saying that it is not anti-Semitism to call for an ultimatum for Israel to stop defending herself? And what's your problem with the bulldozing? (And I won't accept the lie that Israel is bulldozing entire settlements or "camps", whatever that is, for no reason. It's an anti-Semitic lie and I refuse to join an argument about things Israel doesn't do.)

I hope this is not really the extend of American "friendship" with Israel: holding back the anti-Semitism a tiny bit.

I don't think Israel ever critizised the FBI for destroying the home of a criminal who resistered arrest violently and I find it surprising that such a critique would apparently not only be appropriate the other way around but that it has been a sign of a great friendship that the US has so far not done it.

~Leauki~

I'm afraid that your bias is blinding you to what Israel has done in regards to Palestinians. If you're not willing to listen, as you've shown, then i'm not going to waste my time.

you've got to be kidding!!!! 

and your bias is blinding you as well Lucas. 

KFC, I never said that I didn't agree with the fact that Israel has it hard, but the fact is we, as a nation, give too many pats on the backs to Israel. There's evidence out there that show Israel having bulldozed, destroying people's homes. Sorry, but that's bullshit.

and why were they doing this?  For no reason? 

For crying out loud.  Go get yourself a Middle East Map and look how small Israel is.  And then look at how all their enemies are surrounding them.  Also you should know that most of the Middle Eastern Maps over there don't have Israel on them.  They've all taken her right off the map.  That's how they want it.

The day after Israel became a Nation in 1948, she had six Arab nations at her door declaring war on this newborn Nation.  Most of the world thought Israel would be stillborn that day.  God intervened.  God is behind Israel and the day we abandon her, someone better help us because God won't be there. 

If it weren't for us.  There would be no Israel. 

The reference about God is your opinion, and I respectfully disagree.

As for the maps - I know this, but that still doesn't mean we should pat Israel on the back consistantly. Help when help is needed, but scold when scolding is needed. Right? You don't go and constantly give a child encouragement when they do things wrong, right?

You don't destroy people's homes! If you're fighting a war against terrorists, you go after the terrorists. If you don't know where they are in a given area, then you look harder.

I am indeed biased against accepting lies.

And if you are unwilling to let people correct the lies you retell (I don't think you make that stuff up yourself. You just read it somewhere and assume it is true for some reason.), you will remain an anti-Semite, even if it is purely accidental that you happened to decide to believe the lies.

No. There is evidence that Israel has bulldozed the homes of terrorists. Israel did not just "destroy people's homes". That's an anti-Semitic lie. And there is nothing wrong with being biased against believing such lies.

I am from Germany. I have seen what believing such lies can do to a country.

The subject of bulldozing "homes" came up before on JU. And when I asked for the "evidence", all I got was a link to an article where the BBC claimed, probably rightly so, that Israel did indeed bulldoze a police station during a battle. Leaving out even the fact that this is a very humane form of fighting a war (it's better than to kill your enemies and/or bomb the building and it gives everyone inside time to flee), I can see that this story had somehow "evolved" into "Israel is destroying people's homes".

And that, my friend, is anti-Semitism. That's what it looks like.

Yes, and they never hide in or fire from "homes", right?

You are an anti-Semite, my friend. You repeat anti-Semitic lies and you don't even care how illogical they sound.

Why ON EARTH would Israel destroy homes INSTEAD of fighting terrorists? Did you think that the Israelis met one evening and decided that the world doesn't hate the Jews enough? Or what's the logic there?

Oh, that reminds me...

Evidence for the bulldozing claim?